Canto
3
Chapter 7: Further Inquiries by Vidura.
(1) S'rî S'uka said: 'Thus speaking with Maitreya Muni, the learned son of Dvaipâyana Vyâsa,Vidura, respectfully expressed a request. (2) Vidura said: 'O brahmin, how can of the Supreme Lord, although He is of the complete whole and the unchangeable, His pastimes take place of acting with the modes of nature while He Himself is outside of them?' (3) Boys willing to play with other boys are enthused in the matter of playing, but how is that different for one who is self-satisfied and at all times detached? (4) Caused to create the universe with the three modes of nature, the primal Self by the potency of the Supreme Lord maintains all of it and again conversely dissolves it. (5) How can He, the Pure Self whose consciousness, nor from Himself, nor from others nor by any time, place or situation is obscured, in the normal position of a living entity be associated with nescience? (6) By what kind of activities does the one Supreme Lord of all this, in whom the living entities dwell, result in either misfortune or misery? (7) On this, o learned one, is, in distress of nescience, my mind causing me trouble and therefore, o great one, please clear the great impurity of my mind.'(8) S'rî S'uka said: 'He, this way urged by Vidura so anxious to find out about the reality, as a great sage acted as if wondered and then without hesitation God-consciously replied.
(9) Maitreya said: 'Saying that of the Supreme Lord one is of illusion, that of the ever liberated of His Lordship there would be insufficiency or the idea of bondage, one becomes logically contradictory. (10) Of that kind of confusion of the identifying self of people one is thus bereft of meaning, which from the outside looks like if one's own head is being cut off. (11) The way because of the quality of water the moon reflected in it is trembling, offers the quality of the body, an illusory image to the seer differing from it. (12) In this existence does, in bhakti-yoga relating to the Fortunate One, indeed that [illusion] diminish gradually, when one by the mercy of Vâsudeva is engaged in detachment. (13) When the senses thus are satisfied with the observing soul that to the Lord finds engagement in transcendence, are the miseries completely vanquished as if one has enjoyed sound sleep. (14) If one can put an end to all kinds of misery by simply listening to the repeated explanations about the qualities of Murarî [Krishna as the enemy of Mura], what then again to say of the, to one's heart's desire, serving of the dust of His lotus feet?''
(15) Vidura said: 'O learned one, you're perfectly right in stating that [reasoning from] the deluding energy of the Lord is not the path for the soul to follow; it proves itself as meaningless without the basis of the Supreme root outside of which one misses the point. (16) All these explanations you gave are as good as they should be, o learned one, the self is not without the apparent meaning in being moved by the external of the Lord, as outside the origin of the Supreme there is no basis. (17) In this world the one slowest of understanding and the one of transcendental intelligence both enjoy in happiness while the persons in between do suffer. (18) Having aknowledged and being convinced of what is insubstantial, of that what is not the soul, am I, by the service of your feet, thus able to give up [the notion that one is in illusion because of the Lord]. (19) In serving the Personality of Godhead who is the unchangeable enemy of the demon Madhu, one develops, in different relationships [râsas] to the feet, the highly ecstatic that vanquishes distress. (20) Of those who are meager in their austerity it is certainly rarely seen that they are on the path of service towards the Kingdom of God [Vaikunthha] in which the Lord by the godly is always glorified as the controller of all living beings.
(21) After the creation of first the complete of the material energy, in a gradual process of differentiation [evolution] the universal form manifested along with its senses and organs in which later the Almighty entered [for His incarnations]. (22) He who is called the original person has thousands of limbs, legs and hands living in all the worlds of the universe according the evolution of each. (23) You explained how there are three kinds of life [to the modes] in which one has ten kinds of life-force with the [five] senses and their [fivefold] interest, please describe now to me what the specific powers of the societal divisions are. (24) In these [divisions] has, with the sons, grandsons and family-members of the different generations, that prowess spread itself in the different forms of existence. (25) What were all the Manus [heads of the age], and also the generations that for certain followed, to which He was decided as the leader or the father of the living beings [the prajâpati, or Brahmâ] of the generations, and what was their descend? (26) What worlds are there at the head and which earthly worlds are lying beneath, o son of Mitrâ; please describe what their situation is and what the extend of their worldly locations is. (27) Describe me the infrahuman, the human and the superhuman, as there are the generations and subdivisions of the ones born from the reptiles [or the birds], from wombs, from moist, from the twice-born and from the soil [the plants and vegetables]. (28) Kindly describe the incarnations to the modes of material nature for the creation, maintenance and destruction of the universe and the magnanimous activities of the one Personality of Godhead who forms the ultimate shelter.
(29) What are to the respective divisions of the statusorientations to age and vocation in society the embodiments, the character and the births of the sages and their activities, and the divisions of the Veda in categories? (30) And of what sacrifices and ways are the expansions of the yogic capacity, o master, and what is the path of devotional service, in the nonmaterial interest and analytical study as well, of relating to the Personality of God with regulative principles? (31) The paths and imperfections of the faithless, they who go against the grain, and the situation and movements of the individual souls as many as there are to the modes and the types of work, what are they? (32) And what are the non-contradictory causes of religiosity, economic development, sense-gratification and salvation, what are the different means of livelihood, the codes of law, the scriptural injunctions and what are the different regulative principles? (33) How are the periodical offerings of respect regulated, o brahmin, to that what the forefathers have created and how are the timedurations settled to the planets, the stars and luminaries? (34) What may one expect from charity, penance and the endeavoring for reservoirs of water and how are the duties described for someone away from home and for a man in danger? (35) Please describe to me, o sinless one, how He as either the Supreme Person, the Father of the Religion, or the Controller of All, or as all of these can be satisfied completely. (36) O best among the brahmins, please describe the spiritual masters so kind to the needy, who tell their followers, their disciples and sons, even what they didn't ask for. (37) O supreme one, how many dissolutions are there for the elements of nature, who are they who in this are thereupon saved, and who are they who [of praise] may join in Him when He is asleep? (38) And what is the nature and identity of as well the individual person as of the Supreme, what is the leading motive of the vedic wisdom and what moves the guru and his disciples? (39) How in the world is from a person his devotion as also his detachment, there the source of the self-sufficient spiritual knowledge as defended by the spotless devotees?
(40) All these questions I asked in the desire to know about the pastimes of the Lord; please answer them to me as a friend for those ignorant ones who lost their vision by the external energy. (41) All the Vedas, sacrifices, charities and penances, o spotless one, do for sure not even partially compare to the freedom from fear that an individual soul is offered by a person imparting the teaching [like you].'
(42) S'rî S'uka said: 'He [Maitreya], the chief among the sages so well known with the stories [Purânas], thus being questioned by the chief of the Kurus was sufficiently satisfied and inspired and thus being stimulated on the topics about the Supreme Lord, he smilingly replied Vidura.'
Second edition, loaded 19 May, 2006.
Source texts:
Further Inquiries by Vidura
S'rî S'uka said: 'Thus speaking with Maitreya Muni, the learned son of Dvaipâyana Vyâsa, Vidura, learning from Him, respectfully expressed a request.S'rî S'ukadeva Gosvâmî said: O King, while Maitreya, the great sage, was thus speaking, Vidura, the learned son of Dvaipâyana Vyâsa, expressed a request in a pleasing manner by asking this question. (Vedabase)
Vidura said: 'O brahmin, how can of the Supreme Lord, although He is of the complete whole and the unchangeable, His pastimes take place of acting with the modes of nature while He Himself is outside of them?'
S'rî Vidura said: O great brâhmana, since the Supreme Personality of Godhead is the complete spiritual whole and is unchangeable, how is He connected with the material modes of nature and their activities? If this is His pastime, how do the activities of the unchangeable take place and exhibit qualities without the modes of nature. (Vedabase) ?
Boys willing to play with other boys are enthused in the matter of playing, but how is that different for one who is self-satisfied and at all times detached?
Boys are enthusiastic to play with other boys or with various diversions because they are encouraged by desire. But there is no possibility of such desire for the Lord because He is self-satisfied and detached from everything at all times. (Vedabase)
Caused to create the universe with the three modes of nature, the primal Self by the potency of the Supreme Lord maintains all of it and again conversely dissolves it.
By His self-sheltered potency of the three modes of material nature, the Lord has caused the creation of this universe. By her He maintains the creation and conversely dissolves it, again and again. (Vedabase)
How can He, the Pure Self whose consciousness, nor from Himself, nor from others nor by any time, place or situation is obscured, in the normal position of a living entity be associated with nescience?
The pure soul is pure consciousness and is never out of consciousness, either due to circumstances, time, situations, dreams or other causes. How then does he become engaged in nescience? (Vedabase)
By what kind of activities does the one Supreme Lord of all this, in whom the living entities dwell, result in either misfortune or misery?
The Lord, as the Supersoul, is situated in every living being's heart. Why then do the living entities' activities result in misfortune and misery? (Vedabase)
On this, o learned one, is, in distress of nescience, my mind causing me trouble and therefore, o great one, please clear the great impurity of my mind.
O great and learned one, my mind is greatly illusioned by the distress of this nescience, and I therefore request you to clear it up. (Vedabase)
S'rî S'uka said: " He, this way urged by Vidura so anxious to find out about the reality, as a great sage acted as if wondered and then without hesitation God-consciously replied.
S'rî S'ukadeva Gosvâmî said: O King, Maitreya, being thus agitated by the inquisitive Vidura, at first seemed astonished, but then he replied to him without hesitation, since he was fully God conscious. (Vedabase)
Maitreya said: 'Saying that of the Supreme Lord one is of illusion, that of the ever liberated of His Lordship there would be insufficiency or the idea of bondage, one becomes logically contradictory.
S'rî Maitreya said: Certain conditioned souls put forward the theory that the Supreme Brahman, or the Personality of Godhead, is overcome by illusion, or mâyâ, and at the same time they maintain that He is unconditioned. This is against all logic. (Vedabase)
Of that kind of confusion of the identifying self of people one is thus bereft of meaning, which from the outside looks like one's own head has been cut off.
The living entity is in distress regarding his self-identity. He has no factual background, like a man who dreams that he sees his head cut off. (Vedabase)
The way because of the quality of water the moon reflected in it is trembling, offers the quality of the body, an illusory image to the seer differing from it.
As the moon reflected on water appears to the seer to tremble due to being associated with the quality of the water, so the self associated with matter appears to be qualified as matter. (Vedabase)
In this existence does, in bhakti-yoga relating to the Fortunate One, indeed that [illusion] diminish gradually, when one by the mercy of Vâsudeva is engaged in detachment.
But that misconception of self-identity can be diminished gradually by the mercy of the Personality of Godhead, Vâsudeva, through the process of devotional service to the Lord in the mode of detachment. (Vedabase)
When the senses thus are satisfied with the observing soul that to the Lord finds engagement in transcendence, are the miseries completely vanquished as if one has enjoyed sound sleep.
When the senses are satisfied in the seer-Supersoul, the Personality of Godhead, and merge in Him, all miseries are completely vanquished, as after a sound sleep. (Vedabase)
If one can put an end to all kinds of misery by simply listening to the repeated explanations about the qualities of Murarî [Krishna as the enemy of Mura], what then again to say of the, to one's heart's desire, serving of the dust of His lotus feet?'
Simply by chanting and hearing of the transcendental name, form, etc., of the Personality of Godhead, S'rî Krishna, one can achieve the cessation of unlimited miserable conditions. Therefore what to speak of those who have attained attraction for serving the flavor of the dust of the Lord's lotus feet? (Vedabase)
Vidura said: 'O learned one, you're perfectly right in stating that [reasoning from] the deluding energy of the Lord is not the path for the soul to follow; it proves itself as meaningless without the basis of the Supreme root outside of which one misses the point.
Vidura said: O powerful sage; my lord, all my doubts about the Supreme Personality of Godhead and the living entities have now been removed by your convincing words. My mind is now perfectly entering into them. (Vedabase)All these explanations you gave are as good as they should be, o learned one, the self is not without the apparent meaning in being moved by the external of the Lord, as outside the origin of the Supreme there is no basis.
O learned sage, your explanations are very good, as they should be. Disturbances to the conditioned soul have no other basis than the movement of the external energy of the Lord. (Vedabase)
In this world the one slowest of understanding and the one of transcendental intelligence both enjoy in happiness while the persons in between do suffer.
Both the lowest of fools and he who is transcendental to all intelligence enjoy happiness, whereas persons between them suffer the material pangs. (Vedabase)
Having aknowledged and being convinced of what is insubstantial, of that what is not the soul, am I, by the service of your feet, thus able to give up [the notion that one is in illusion because of the Lord].
But, my dear sir, I am obliged to you because now I can understand that this material manifestation is without substance, although it appears real. I am confident that by serving your feet it will be possible for me to give up the false idea. (Vedabase)
In serving the Personality of Godhead who is the unchangeable enemy of the demon Madhu, one develops, in different relationships [râsas] to the feet, the highly ecstatic that vanquishes distress.
By serving the feet of the spiritual master, one is enabled to develop transcendental ecstasy in the service of the Personality of Godhead, who is the unchangeable enemy of the Madhu demon and whose service vanquishes one's material distresses. (Vedabase)
Of those who are meager in their austerity it is certainly rarely seen that they are on the path of service towards the Kingdom of God [Vaikunthha] in which the Lord by the godly is always glorified as the controller of all living beings.
Persons whose austerity is meager can hardly obtain the service of the pure devotees who are progressing on the path back to the kingdom of Godhead, the Vaikunthhas. Pure devotees engage one hundred percent in glorifying the Supreme Lord, who is the Lord of the demigods and the controller of all living entities. (Vedabase)
After the creation of first the complete of the material energy, in a gradual process of differentiation [evolution] the universal form manifested along with its senses and organs in which later the Almighty entered [for His incarnations].
After creating the total material energy, the mahat-tattva, and thereby manifesting the gigantic universal form with senses and sense organs, the Supreme Lord entered within it. (Vedabase)
He who is called the original person has thousands of limbs, legs and hands living in all the worlds of the universe according the evolution of each.
The purusha incarnation lying on the Causal Ocean is called the original purusha in the material creations, and in His virât form, in whom all the planets and their inhabitants live. He has many thousands of legs and hands. (Vedabase)
You explained how there are three kinds of life [to the modes] in which one has ten kinds of life-force with the [five] senses and their [fivefold] interest, please describe now to me what the specific powers of the societal divisions are.
O great brâhmana, you have told me that the gigantic virât form and His senses, sense objects and ten kinds of life air exist with three kinds of life vigor. Now, if you will, kindly explain to me the different powers of the specific divisions. (Vedabase)
In these [divisions] has, with the sons, grandsons and family-members of the different generations, that prowess spread itself in the different forms of existence.
O my lord, I think that the prowess manifest in the forms of sons, grandsons and family members has spread all over the universe in different varieties and species. (Vedabase)
What were all the Manus [heads of the age], and also the generations that for certain followed, to which He was decided as the leader or the father of the living beings [the prajâpati, or Brahmâ] of the generations, and what was their descend?
O learned brâhmana, please describe how the leader of all the demigods, namely Prajâpati, Brahmâ, decided to establish the various Manus, the heads of the ages. Please describe the Manus also, and please describe the descendants of those Manus. (Vedabase)
What worlds are there at the head and which earthly worlds are lying beneath, o son of Mitrâ; please describe what their situation is and what the extend of their worldly locations is.
O son of Mitrâ, kindly describe how the planets are situated above the earth as well as underneath it, and also please mention their measurement as well as that of the earthly planets. (Vedabase)
Describe me the infrahuman, the human and the superhuman, as there are the generations and subdivisions of the ones born from the reptiles [or the birds], from wombs, from moist, from the twice-born and from the soil [the plants and vegetables].
Also please describe the living beings under different classifications: subhumans, humans, those born of the embryo, those born of perspiration, those who are twice-born [birds], and the plants and vegetables. Kindly describe their generations and subdivisions also. (Vedabase)
Kindly describe the incarnations to the modes of material nature for the creation, maintenance and destruction of the universe and the magnanimous activities of the one Personality of Godhead who forms the ultimate shelter.
Please also describe the incarnations of the material modes of nature-Brahmâ, Vishnu and Mahes'vara-and please describe the incarnation of the Supreme Personality of Godhead and His magnanimous activities. (Vedabase)
What are to the respective divisions of the statusorientations to age and vocation in society the embodiments, the character and the births of the sages and their activities, and the divisions of the Veda in categories?
O great sage, kindly describe the divisions and orders of human society in terms of symptoms, behavior and the characteristics of mental equilibrium and sense control. Also please describe the births of the great sages and the categorical divisions of the Vedas. (Vedabase)
And of what sacrifices and ways are the expansions of the yogic capacity, o master, and what is the path of devotional service, in the nonmaterial interest and analytical study as well, of relating to the Personality of God with regulative principles?
Please also describe the expansions of different sacrifices and the paths of mystic powers, analytical study of knowledge, and devotional service, all with their respective regulation. (Vedabase)
The paths and imperfections of the faithless, they who go against the grain, and the situation and movements of the individual souls as many as there are to the modes and the types of work, what are they?
Please also describe the imperfections and contradictions of the faithless atheists, the situation of crossbreeding, and the movements of the living entities in various species of life according to their particular modes of nature and work. (Vedabase)
And what are the non-contradictory causes of religiosity, economic development, sense-gratification and salvation, what are the different means of livelihood, the codes of law, the scriptural injunctions and what are the different regulative principles?
You may also describe the noncontradictory causes of religiosity, economic development, sense gratification and salvation and also the different means of livelihood and different processes of law and order as mentioned in the revealed scriptures. (Vedabase)
How are the periodical offerings of respect regulated, o brahmin, to that what the forefathers have created and how are the timedurations settled to the planets, the stars and luminaries?
Please also explain the regulations for offering respects to the forefathers, the creation of the Pitriloka, the time schedule in the planets, stars and luminaries, and their respective situations. (Vedabase)
What may one expect from charity, penance and the endeavoring for reservoirs of water and how are the duties described for someone away from home and for a man in danger?
Please also describe the fruitive results of charity and penance and of digging reservoirs of water. Please describe the situation of persons who are away from home and also the duty of a man in an awkward position. (Vedabase)
Please describe to me, o sinless one, how He as either the Supreme Person, the Father of the Religion, the Controller of All, or as all of these can be satisfied completely.
O sinless one, because the Personality of Godhead, the controller of all living entities, is the father of all religion and all those who are candidates for religious activities, kindly describe how He can be completely satisfied. (Vedabase)
O best among the brahmins, please describe the spiritual masters so kind to the needy, who tell their followers, their disciples and sons, even what they didn't ask for.
O best among the brâhmanas, those who are spiritual masters are very kind to the needy. They are always kind to their followers, disciples and sons, and without being asked by them, the spiritual master described all that is knowledge. (Vedabase)
O supreme one, how many dissolutions are there for the elements of nature, who are they who in this are thereupon saved, and who are they who [of praise] may join in Him when He is asleep?
Please describe how many dissolutions there are for the elements of material nature and who survives after the dissolutions to serve the Lord while He is asleep. (Vedabase)
And what is the nature and identity of as well the individual person as of the Supreme, what is the leading motive of the vedic wisdom and what moves the guru and his disciples?
What are the truths regarding the living entities and the Supreme Personality of Godhead? What are their identities? What are the specific values in the knowledge in the Vedas, and what are the necessities for the spiritual master and his disciples? (Vedabase)
How in the world is from a person his devotion as also his detachment, there the source of the self-sufficient spiritual knowledge as defended by the spotless devotees?
Spotless devotees of the Lord have mentioned the source of such knowledge. How could one have knowledge of devotional service and detachment without the help of such devotees? (Vedabase)
All these questions I asked in the desire to know about the pastimes of the Lord; please answer them to me as a friend for those ignorant ones who lost their vision by the external energy.
My dear sage, I have put all these questions before you with a view to knowing the pastimes of Hari, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. You are the friend of all, so kindly describe them for all those who have lost their vision. (Vedabase)
All the Vedas, sacrifices, charities and penances, o spotless one, do for sure not even partially compare to the freedom from fear that an individual soul is offered by a person imparting the teaching [like you].
O spotless one, your answers to all these questions will grant immunity from all material miseries. Such charity is greater than all Vedic charities, sacrifices, penances, etc.. (Vedabase)
S'rî S'uka said: 'He [Maitreya], the chief among the sages so well known with the stories [Purânas], thus being questioned by the chief of the Kurus was sufficiently satisfied and inspired and thus being stimulated on the topics about the Supreme Lord, he smilingly replied Vidura.
S'rî S'ukadeva Gosvâmî said: Thus the chief of the sages, who was always enthusiastic about describing topics regarding the Personality of Godhead, began to narrate the descriptive explanation of the Purânas, being so infused by Vidura. He was very much enlivened by speaking on the transcendental activities of the Lord. (Vedabase)
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